I'd considered reading others' comments before responding but, as I am one of the people involved in a breakup and am thusly trying to sort out my ownhead when it comes to this, I figured I would give my own response initially.
The reason I have trouble responding to your poll involves wording. I don't think it's ever really ok to demand counseling or mediation. The closest exception to this would be a "for the kids" situation, and even then, not really a demand. Suggest? Sure. Request that a discussion at least happen about the utility of it? Yes. But no demands.
The notion of "talking someone out of it" has more gray area than I particularly like. Is asking someone for their perspective part of talking them out of it? Is asking for "reasons?" Does asking for reasons automatically presume the dumper having to justify their decision? What about the dumpee presenting their own impression? Is asking if this could be surmountable given what the dumper and dumpee has said considered talking them into it? If the dumper says it isn't, is asking why they feel that way wrong?
See, I don't think any of these things have to be wrong. I consider it in the spirit of open, honest communication. It should, however, be done as much as possible in a spirit of balance. The dumpee is likely to be hurt, depressed, angry, confused, any number of things. That can lead to communication considered excessive, irrational or manipulative. This should be avoided, particularly in situations with a dumper who tends to be exceptionally accomodating or is new to relationships or breakups.
This is where I fell down with my most recent breakup. I've tried not to judge myself too harshly for it given the circumstances; I was responding to the second of two "breakups" that were by my perception completely out of the blue. (I had perceived the first as more of a panic mode a la, "ACK ACK I HAVE ISSUES WITH THINGS AND DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX THEM BUT I HAVEN'T MENTIONED THIS TO YOU YET WE BREAK UP NOW OK?!") Both had been done in a manner that I considered incredibly poor form, the first over voicemail and the second via a note. I left the first breakup feeling as though my partner had not considered communicated with me about the possibilities of improvement until after considering breaking up with me, and had expressly asked that he not break up with me via e-mail, mail, voicemail or any other non-real-time medium and address the reasons why, preferably with a hope to fix things before it got to the breaking point. The second "breakup" seemed similarly out of the blue to me, was done over a non-real-time medium, and every time I asked about his impressions or reasons, they changed. I was left feeling very confused, helpless and hurt. Add that to the other life stressors I had at the time, and I wasn't in a good state to respond with clarity or balance.
And I didn't, especially not at first. I cried. I tried to reason. I begged. I yelled. I even said hurtful things I really shouldn't have. It was more about how it was happening rather than that it was happening, but that doesn't absolve it. No one should have to go through this, especially someone in their first relationship initiating their first breakup.
Bottom line: I didn't trust him with his decision. I felt he had made a rash choice informed by inexperience, poor communication and cowardice, and I was pissed. The problem with this is that even if he did do all these things -- and I'm not saying whether I feel he did, still -- that's his choice. He's an independent operative, and I don't have any right to tell him not to make that choice.
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timeasmymeasure
Thoughts - Part I
Date: 2006-06-06 05:18 pm (UTC)The reason I have trouble responding to your poll involves wording. I don't think it's ever really ok to demand counseling or mediation. The closest exception to this would be a "for the kids" situation, and even then, not really a demand. Suggest? Sure. Request that a discussion at least happen about the utility of it? Yes. But no demands.
The notion of "talking someone out of it" has more gray area than I particularly like. Is asking someone for their perspective part of talking them out of it? Is asking for "reasons?" Does asking for reasons automatically presume the dumper having to justify their decision? What about the dumpee presenting their own impression? Is asking if this could be surmountable given what the dumper and dumpee has said considered talking them into it? If the dumper says it isn't, is asking why they feel that way wrong?
See, I don't think any of these things have to be wrong. I consider it in the spirit of open, honest communication. It should, however, be done as much as possible in a spirit of balance. The dumpee is likely to be hurt, depressed, angry, confused, any number of things. That can lead to communication considered excessive, irrational or manipulative. This should be avoided, particularly in situations with a dumper who tends to be exceptionally accomodating or is new to relationships or breakups.
This is where I fell down with my most recent breakup. I've tried not to judge myself too harshly for it given the circumstances; I was responding to the second of two "breakups" that were by my perception completely out of the blue. (I had perceived the first as more of a panic mode a la, "ACK ACK I HAVE ISSUES WITH THINGS AND DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX THEM BUT I HAVEN'T MENTIONED THIS TO YOU YET WE BREAK UP NOW OK?!") Both had been done in a manner that I considered incredibly poor form, the first over voicemail and the second via a note. I left the first breakup feeling as though my partner had not considered communicated with me about the possibilities of improvement until after considering breaking up with me, and had expressly asked that he not break up with me via e-mail, mail, voicemail or any other non-real-time medium and address the reasons why, preferably with a hope to fix things before it got to the breaking point. The second "breakup" seemed similarly out of the blue to me, was done over a non-real-time medium, and every time I asked about his impressions or reasons, they changed. I was left feeling very confused, helpless and hurt. Add that to the other life stressors I had at the time, and I wasn't in a good state to respond with clarity or balance.
And I didn't, especially not at first. I cried. I tried to reason. I begged. I yelled. I even said hurtful things I really shouldn't have. It was more about how it was happening rather than that it was happening, but that doesn't absolve it. No one should have to go through this, especially someone in their first relationship initiating their first breakup.
Bottom line: I didn't trust him with his decision. I felt he had made a rash choice informed by inexperience, poor communication and cowardice, and I was pissed. The problem with this is that even if he did do all these things -- and I'm not saying whether I feel he did, still -- that's his choice. He's an independent operative, and I don't have any right to tell him not to make that choice.